Curse

Avarre · Mar 18, 2006, 04:30 PM // 16:30

In that case, the amount drained by continual energy burn is 10 - (20s recharge * 1.33) = -16.6

However, we use drained from starting base value to determine amount reduced, generally.

Dragannia · Mar 18, 2006, 10:41 PM // 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Have you ever played against or as a boon monk? Presto, focus swap, contemplation of purity

Now, let's see about that. I'm assuming you mean a 15/-1. So, they do a focus swap, CoP, and they're down to 10 energy. Then they swap back to their original wand and focus, to -5. Mind you the regen itself would take 3 or so seconds to get back to positives, though the upkeep regen would get it down. Then, they need to cast boon.

Avarre · Mar 19, 2006, 03:19 AM // 03:19

Or, mayhaps, they can use OoB to return to positive. Most monks carry a positive energy set, if they get too low and need to heal they switch, heal some, oob to positive and switch back.

More importantly, your entire hex chain is devastated, and you're down your entire energy bar (not to mention your hex string cost 35 and more from necro).

thor hammerbane · Mar 19, 2006, 04:13 AM // 04:13

Its a pretty nice skill for illusion mesmers w/ inspiration. I spam degen on their entire team untill my energy is gone, i hit ether lord, and i lose no energy, i gain more regen, and the target has energy degen. Good skill for energy management imo

Avarre · Mar 19, 2006, 05:02 AM // 05:02

You lose 5 + 2 (regenned while casting) energy. The total net gain is 3 at best (16 insp). Horrible energy management, considering you can only use it when absolutely none remaining, else you make a loss..

Arcanis the Omnipotent · Mar 19, 2006, 06:16 AM // 06:16

The skill needs a buff. I havent looked at it twice.

Its concept is great. But its on the same regard as Blackout really. It disables both you and your target.

The difference here is you dont recover any faster, and it isnt useable as a constant shutdown like Blackout is.

Dragannia · Mar 19, 2006, 07:02 AM // 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Or, mayhaps, they can use OoB to return to positive. Most monks carry a positive energy set, if they get too low and need to heal they switch, heal some, oob to positive and switch back.

More importantly, your entire hex chain is devastated, and you're down your entire energy bar (not to mention your hex string cost 35 and more from necro).

People still use Offering of Blood? That skill has gone down the drain ever since they buffed its sacrifice cost.

The point of Ether Lord is to use it at 5 energy, losing little, then switch to a different target and boost your own energy with Drain or Tap.

Wretchman Drake · Mar 19, 2006, 07:23 AM // 07:23

Ether Lord is decent when you have reached 0 or little above energy. Only a moron would think to use it right away before battle...

Gildor Took · Mar 19, 2006, 07:25 AM // 07:25

not the best form of energy management for mesmers as stated above its use is very situational since it has to be used when your energy level is 0 or very close to it to be effective. Can be useful in pve but I think it would be near useless in pvp.

LightningHell · Mar 19, 2006, 07:46 AM // 07:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wretchman Drake

Ether Lord is decent when you have reached 0 or little above energy. Only a moron would think to use it right away before battle...

I don't really plan on having my energy down on 0 and still in the offensive side of the game, actually...

Oh wait, I've left this thread officially...

Banebow · Mar 19, 2006, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

However, we use drained from starting base value to determine amount reduced, generally.

I thought I had made it clear that some of the energy drained was potential energy, not actual energy. Apparently I had not.

When a monk is hexed with just ether lord and it lasts for 10 seconds, we say that ether lord drains 10 and we get 10. But ether lord never actually drains physical energy. Rather, it drains potential energy.

If I have panic on me am I not getting drained? My energy pool is not going down from that starting base value, so we should assume that I am fine and need no removal, correct? After all, my base starting value of energy from when I got hexed with panic to 10 seconds later has gone up, not down. Does that mean panic does not drain energy? If we want to use different words we can, such as saying panic has prevented some energy, both terms are correct. But panic has not drained energy from my physical energy pool, it has drained it from my potential energy pool. That does not mean it should not be factored in to amount drained.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

In that case, the amount drained by continual energy burn is 10 - (20s recharge * 1.33) = -16.6

So a monk who was at 20e when you drained him is now at 36.6e. Add panic and we have 10 - (20s * 0.66) = -3.2. A monk at 20e who gets burned is now at 23.2e. Did panic not drain the 13.4 energy between these two numbers? If we want, we can say it as "panic drained 13.4 potential energy" instead of "panic drained 13.4 energy" but that 13.4 energy went somewhere, and I doubt the exact terminology matters much. The same applies with ether lord.

mariano · Mar 19, 2006, 04:35 PM // 16:35

I was testing Ether Lord in the Random Arenas with this build:

Fast casting:3
Illusion: 7
Domination: 16
Inspiration: 12

Phantom Pain
Shatter Delusions
Energy Surge
Energy Burn
Distortion
Ether Lord
Ether Feast
Resurrection Signet

With Inspiration 12 Ether Lord 9 seconds +3 regeneration mean 9-5=+4 energy on caster, and -9 in foe.
With Inspiration 11 Ether Lord 9 seconds +2 regeneration mean 18/3-5=+1 energy on caster, and -6 in foe.

The build was working nicely. Until I became aware that I was losing 3 energy on each evaded attack...
So I went back to my former build:
illusion 8, Inspiration 10, for: Distortion + Spirit of Failure.

When using Ether Lord the caster loses all energy, so that it may be used when runing out of energy only, as there is always a chance that more than 5 energy will be lost on casting, Inspiration 12 is a must. Where not for that, I would have been satisfied. I would like there were at least one more inspiration skill for selfprotection or selfhealing.

Eaimirth Etaivella · Mar 19, 2006, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

You lose 5 + 2 (regenned while casting) energy. The total net gain is 3 at best (16 insp). Horrible energy management, considering you can only use it when absolutely none remaining, else you make a loss..

Thank you =D
Very bad for gaining energy, no idea why people keep bringing this up.

Avarre · Mar 20, 2006, 08:29 AM // 08:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banebow

insert redundant stuff here

In case you neglected to realize, I was counting the direct from-base reduction of the previously stated hex chain, of Panic + Wither + Malaise + Ether lord. Panic does not drain energy, it reduces regen. Once regen is thrown below a certain point, it causes energy degen, and thus brings about a direct reduction of energy, which is what I'm counting.

Honestly, I don't give a crap on how you want to stylize you answer to make it look intelligent. The fact of the matter is, after the 4-hex chain is applied, 10 seconds later you will be down 16.6 energy from your starting amount. This is not contestable. Likewise, energy burn is counted as loss from base at time of application/casting, otherwise we wouldn't even state it was an energy reduction spell (because you'd regen 16.6 from base in the time it took to recast).

Quote:

People still use Offering of Blood? That skill has gone down the drain ever since they buffed its sacrifice cost

People still use it, just use it more selectively. But ok, lets use a more recent monk build, one using, say, energy drain. Same thing, -5 and +16, netting you a quick boost equal to that of OoB. Recharge time isn't an issue here because we're talking about direct increase to get back into positives, not debating on which skill is superior.

LightningHell · Mar 20, 2006, 09:48 AM // 09:48

I wouldn't want you to waste your time, Avarre. Just stop posting in the thread, and let the ignorant go rot.

Serra Knightfang · Mar 20, 2006, 05:21 PM // 17:21

Sorry for the complete retardedness that this question must present; I have searched and searched and simply cannot find the answer.

What exactly is Focus Swapping? Could someone explain the whole process.

JR · Mar 20, 2006, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Serra Knightfang

Sorry for the complete retardedness that this question must present; I have searched and searched and simply cannot find the answer.

What exactly is Focus Swapping? Could someone explain the whole process.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...nergy+ denial

The search function is most usefull, is it not.

Serra Knightfang · Mar 20, 2006, 05:40 PM // 17:40

I swear to god I looked for those f'ing search buttons before I posted that!
But, like I said...retardedness
Thanks

mariano · Mar 20, 2006, 07:18 PM // 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...nergy+ denial

The search function is most usefull, is it not.

But, Ether Lord energy degeneration does not seem to be affected by energy droping to 0... may Ether Lord degeneration affect hidden regeneration on a negative energy state? and may Ether Lord make energy to become negative for a warrior?

what is the answer?

Banebow · Mar 20, 2006, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariano

may Ether Lord degeneration affect hidden regeneration on a negative energy state? and may Ether Lord make energy to become negative for a warrior?

If you had your energy at 0 and then switched to a -energy focus item, yes, your regen would still be slower for the "hidden" energy. You won't be able to take a warrior to negative energy however.